Monday, April 23, 2007
So Much For Legislative Expertise
Remember Tipper Gore testifying about dirty rock and pop lyrics before a House sub-committee about 15 years ago? I think Frank Zappa and John Denver testified as well. Tipper's efforts helped, in an unknown way, to bring about the voluntary and pretty much useless warning label on CDs regarding lyrics. Here's a story I recall about her expertise in the field. Someone asked her about the movie Wayne's World and she said she liked it, especially the part where the metal heads (her words) were riding around listening to opera*.
Just because you're trying to pass a law which will effect thousands to millions of people for the rest of time, that doesn't mean you actually have to know anything about the subject or even about the details of your proposed legislation. Take Representative Carolyn McCarthy (D-Long Island, NY). She is trying to bring back a harsher version of the assault gun ban (and clip or magazine proper capacity manufacturing ban). She even wants to ban "barrel shrouds." What are those, you ask? Well, let's go to the videotape and see if Rep. McCarthy can explain the term to Tucker Carlson. The tape is very short.
A barrel shroud, in case you actually cared, is usually a piece of metal, often a cylinder and often perforated with holes in a regular pattern, which goes over an exposed gun barrel and allows the user of the gun to grab the shrouded barrel without burning one's hands. Here's an example below. Wooo, really scary; we can't have people owning those!
Here's the early 20th Century version of the barrel shroud--wood. Would that be banned too?
Just because you're trying to pass a law which will effect thousands to millions of people for the rest of time, that doesn't mean you actually have to know anything about the subject or even about the details of your proposed legislation. Take Representative Carolyn McCarthy (D-Long Island, NY). She is trying to bring back a harsher version of the assault gun ban (and clip or magazine proper capacity manufacturing ban). She even wants to ban "barrel shrouds." What are those, you ask? Well, let's go to the videotape and see if Rep. McCarthy can explain the term to Tucker Carlson. The tape is very short.
A barrel shroud, in case you actually cared, is usually a piece of metal, often a cylinder and often perforated with holes in a regular pattern, which goes over an exposed gun barrel and allows the user of the gun to grab the shrouded barrel without burning one's hands. Here's an example below. Wooo, really scary; we can't have people owning those!
Here's the early 20th Century version of the barrel shroud--wood. Would that be banned too?
* Queen's Bohemian Rhapsody (Listen) is not opera, but rock and roll--wimpy, overproduced, semi-bombastic rock and roll, but rock and roll none the less; and even the least informed of the baby boom generation know it's rock and roll, not opera.
Labels: Gun Control; Ignorance
# posted by Roger Fraley @ 4:24 PM 
Comments:
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Wait, let me get this strait. You are schooling us on gun terminology? Wow. Let me know when you come to your senses on the whole magazine vs. clip debate.
I read the Economist this week (as I do every week) and they used exclusively the term magazine for the, well, MAGAZINES that were in the pistols used in the Virgina Tech massacre.
I suggest you start doing the same.
I read the Economist this week (as I do every week) and they used exclusively the term magazine for the, well, MAGAZINES that were in the pistols used in the Virgina Tech massacre.
I suggest you start doing the same.
Mike, answer my questions: In the M1 Garand, where do the 8 rounds go in the rifle? What is that place called? The piece of metal, which holds the 8 rounds together as you put them in the gun, is called what? Then we'll talk about gun nomenclature. Thanks for chiding.
Q1: That is the magazine. In this case it is a fixed magazine.
Q2: That is a clip.
I don't know much about guns, but this I know.
Q2: That is a clip.
I don't know much about guns, but this I know.
I'd like an exact quote re Tipper Gore and Wayne's World because based on everything I've ever heard both her and her husband the women know their music, and I'm not referring to opera.
Frank Zappa was strongly opposed to censorship of music and testified against such efforts before a senate committee. Al Gore introduced himself to Zappa and told him that he was a big fan. The two became friendly and, after Frank died, his widow Gail begame a major Gore supporter.
Frank Zappa was strongly opposed to censorship of music and testified against such efforts before a senate committee. Al Gore introduced himself to Zappa and told him that he was a big fan. The two became friendly and, after Frank died, his widow Gail begame a major Gore supporter.
# posted by 
: 10:59 AM
: 10:59 AM
Mike, you are correct; where the cartridges go in the gun is the magazine and the metal thing that puts them there in order is a clip. The metal thing that puts them into the Garand and gets sxpelled with the distinctive sproing is not a magazine. Now you know why I call the things full of rounds that we slide into the gun's magazine a clip.
peter b, you'd think that Zappa, whom I like a lot, would be for freedom, but even hokey but sad John Denver testified strongly against putting warning lables on CDs about the lyrics.
peter b, you'd think that Zappa, whom I like a lot, would be for freedom, but even hokey but sad John Denver testified strongly against putting warning lables on CDs about the lyrics.
I already knew that Roger, but it still doesn't make you right. It is a common mistake, but you should stop making it pronto, now that I've taken the time to point it out. (Maybe this is a conservative thing)
Why don't you ask Doug? I'm sure he would know.
This is from the link I sent you, which I'm guessing you haven't looked at.
A magazine (also called a mag or, commonly but incorrectly, especially when removable, a clip) is an ammunition storage and feeding device within or attached to a firearm. Magazines may be integral to the firearm (fixed) or removable (detachable).
...snip!
Some magazines can in turn be loaded by a clip; magazine and clip are not synonymous terms.
(emphasis mine)
So, please, Roger, for Pete's sake, please stop using these terms interchangeably. They are not interchangeable and it is quite unbecoming of someone who considers themselves an expert in weaponry to continue to use these clearly distinct terms is if they were.
And don't believe me, or the links I've sent you. Find out from someone who would know.
Why don't you ask Doug? I'm sure he would know.
This is from the link I sent you, which I'm guessing you haven't looked at.
A magazine (also called a mag or, commonly but incorrectly, especially when removable, a clip) is an ammunition storage and feeding device within or attached to a firearm. Magazines may be integral to the firearm (fixed) or removable (detachable).
...snip!
Some magazines can in turn be loaded by a clip; magazine and clip are not synonymous terms.
(emphasis mine)
So, please, Roger, for Pete's sake, please stop using these terms interchangeably. They are not interchangeable and it is quite unbecoming of someone who considers themselves an expert in weaponry to continue to use these clearly distinct terms is if they were.
And don't believe me, or the links I've sent you. Find out from someone who would know.
Your link was to Wickipedia. Is that the new standard of unimpeachable truth? OK, just for you, unless it's a clip, I'll use magazine, but I'm not correcting anyone else.
Alright! I knew you would make a wikipedia comment. The article is not under challenge, so I think it is accurate. Not the standard, just an easy look-up.
I never expected you to go on a mission with the information, just internalize it and start using the proper nomenclature.
More sources: here, here, here, and here.
Are we adjourned?
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I never expected you to go on a mission with the information, just internalize it and start using the proper nomenclature.
More sources: here, here, here, and here.
Are we adjourned?
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